XT WACF TROUBLES

[debndukes]

Does anyone else have a problem with the caps "popping" off the hoops when running. This has been happening to me since day one and is very aggrivating. I'm hooping them, clipping them and tucking the brim under the clip but still, every once and a while, it comes loose and loses all registration. Please... any suggestions are accepted. Thanks.

[debndukes]

Actually, I just dismantled the hoop. I removed the "tab" that holds the bill of the hat straight up, before you slide the holder onto it and that seems to let the hat shift back just far enough that it hoops very firmly then I just slide the holder stright down without bending the bill for added hold. I'll keep you updated....

[debndukes]

Thanks Bob, it was a pleasure and things "seem" to be working so far.

[Rod or Sharon]

Debnduke.....

Whoa dere..hol-don a minute...

The standoff that you have taken off can lead to a possible very expensive mistake.....

If you notice the way the cap frame is made, the theth of the frame have an inset from about 10 oclock to about 2 oclock. By removing this stand off and pushing the cap farther forward on the frame and if you are sewing a wide design, then the possibllity of needle strikes on the side of the frame is a real possibility.

The standoff is not your problem. The real problem is usually found in not hooping the cap tightly enough and/or bending the bill of the cap back toward your belly as you slide the hat band on to the frame trying to get a deeper bite on the bill seam. IF you do this, then you can expect failure almost every time, especially if the design is tall. If you bend the bill of the cap back, slide the hat band forward , anchor the strap and then try to put the bill of the cap under the bill trap, it spring loads the center portion of the bill seam area, lifts it off the teeth and then the sewing arm will just push it the rest of the way off.

Watch the video on this site that Herb Acree and my wife Sharon made and Herb does an excellent job of demonstrating the correct way to hoop these caps on the XT frames. I think it under Tips & Tricks.

Rod Springer
Amaya Tech & Trainer

[Bill C @ Fineline]

I personally think the XT WACF cap hoops are poor designed. We used a Tajima for caps before buying the XT. We could hoop a cap using a small piece of tearaway in30 sec or less. It a double strap, on with no teeth that went over the bill $ one with teeth that held the cap down. Never had a cap come off, even having it turn to do the side.
We have had the XTs 3 years now and it is a hit & miss. Watched the video and all. We farm big orders out to someone who has Tajimas. To me the teeth don't ketch the cap good enough. We tried removing the standoff, it works but it isn't right

[Sally]

I had the same problem from day one, did not matter how I hooped the cap how tight or where I placed it, 9 out of 10 it would be pushed of registration talked to my Tech about the problem, who said cap shapes are changing he removed the tab that holds the bill in place and have not have a problem since I do a trace first and have no problems
Hope that adds some more info for you
Sally from the land downunder

[BML Builders]

We had the same problem the frames so we went back to the old frames from the Big Red. They work alot better. We also use the conventional frames when we are doing the smaller design widths.

[Bill C @ Fineline]

Does anyone know how far the tab that stops the bill is to be from the teeth on the hoop? On ours it is only 1/8". No way will these teeth catch the cap. I thought about bending that tab so the cap will be on the teeth. Good or Bad?

[Rod or Sharon]

Bill,

BAD.....Watch Herbs video again. These hoops must be used "exactly" as he demonstrates....no deviation....if you follow his lead, then the teeth "will" bite and hold and the cap will stay on the frame as long as the design doesn't get too tall for the particular style of cap being sewn.

Rod Springer

[Bill C @ Fineline]

I have watched Herbs video, but when I hoop a low profile cap with the strap as tight as I can get it, then push the bill in to hook the holder it pushes the cap off the teeth. Hooped one without backing to see where the teeth would grab. The teeth were only on the sweat band and the strap teeth were not contacting the hoop teeth. 1/8" doesn't seam enough to grap the cap. You say do not bend the bill back,only straighting it, then the cap does not get close to the teeth. If someone that is close in Illinois that can hoop them in a productive way, I would like to see them do it. Thanks, Bill

[Rod or Sharon]

Bill,

The real clue in what you are saying is that when you push the bill to get it under the trap, it spring loads the cap up off the teeth.

If the partictular cap being hooped is hooped correctly, then the bill should only need a slight push to get it under the trap. If there is more than approx 1/2 inch then the cap is not sitting flat enough on the gauge.

The "fatal" mistake with these frames is bending the bill back too far, pushing the hat band in closer to the back of the frame and trying to get a deeper bite in the seam. Doing this will result in the bill of the cap standing too straight up and having to push it too far to the rear to get it under the trap which spring loads it up and off the center teeth.

Do I like the design(?), not really, but it is all about learning how to use them and what their limitations are with the particular type/style of cap being hooped.

This is not saying that there are some caps out there that are or can be problem children. The low profiles seem to demand at least two layers of cap backing to help with the teeth holding the seam in place.....a touch of adhesive spray can help here also...I would venture to say that the issue here is a combination of not getting the band tight enough, trying to get a deeper bite as described above, too tall of a design(especially with low profiles), not enough backing, trying to run design to high on the cap and not hooping the cap tight enough, i.e., not ironing the pop out of it on the ring gauge as Herb describes...

Rod Springer
Amaya Tech & Trainer

Rod Springer
Amaya Tech & Trainer

[signman]

I might have missed this being said...but when we hoop hats, as we slide the hat on the frame-we have pulled the 'sweatband' out with our little finger-and once on the frame, run your finger around to get it all pulled out of the way of the teeth. This allows the hat face/brim to get pulled right down to the frame flat...you aren't trying to grab with the teeth into a moving object-the sweatband.

[signman]

This just came in an email blast from Printwear Magazine...I'll just post the 'highlight' from the article since it seemed to be kharma that it came in!

Proper hooping is a staple answer to cap-embroidery problems. The easiest caps to hoop are the ones that fit your cap frame the best. If the cap is flagging (bouncing up and down) you are inviting breaks of thread and needles. A snug fit and proper hooping prevents flagging. So order some samples and try them out on your machine. It’s a good idea to detach the visor from a sample cap and fit the curve of the visor to the curve of your cap gauge. If they are a match, it’s a good style to keep in any inventory and show your customers. It is a good idea to offer only what works best on your machine.

Read more. . . .

[Laurie]

Sorry for your troubles, but glad to see that we are not the only ones who are experiencing trouble with teh XT hoop... it pulls off most the time and I have constant thread breaks when I actually do get teh hat to stay in place!
The teeth in the middle of the band (at teh bill) DO NOT meet and therefiore can not hold the hat firmly enough to hold it in place NO MATTER how tight it is or how well teh sides are holding!!! We order an OLD version, with teh TWO bands and NO bill clip and are hoping that it may work better...

I am so frustrated with doing caps I want to quit my job!!

Laurie

[signman]

Laurie, we use nothing but the CCF hoops, with the (expensive for what you get) 'brim holder attachment'. (nothing but a mini bungee cord!)
But it works...we have one of the WACF hoops around and one of these days I'm going to try a visor on it-cannot load a visor on a CCF hoop and get anymore than 1/2" of sewing area.
So if you can't get the WACF to work, try a CCF!
and watch the video...it does work!