License ? For High Schools

[clint]

I was wondering if you need to have some type of license or contract to make designs representing local high schools,middle schools, soccer leagues and things like that?

[signman]

Yes and no....if the school or league has COPYRIGHTED their logo, then you need PERMISSION from an officer or legal representative of that league. Some leagues may even charge you to use their logo if you are doing work to 'sell', not doing it 'for them'.
Any of your big league teams, NFL, AFL, Baseball, colleges, universitys, will for sure have their logos copyrighted and will pursue you if you do not get permission or the 'rights' to use their logo. Our local school did not have their mascot copyrighted-I did a lot of shirts, jackets, etc. for them-and when the local grocery chain suddenly started selling teeshirts WITHOUT permission or even without donating a portion to the school-they went ballistic and then found out they couldn't do anything. SInce I was in the middle of painting their mascot 15' high on the gym wall, I arranged with the principal to let ME copyright the design I had come up with...and therefor it prevented anyone else from using it. Came in handy the next time a group wanted to reproduce it to raise money for themselves...I was able to stop it right there since I had arranged with the school the 'rights' to all copies of that logo.
Now there is a misconception that you can change a logo or design 10% or so and still do it. Nope...copyright laws changed several years ago so that NO PORTION OF A COPYRIGHTED DESIGN can be used in any shape or form without permission from the copyright holder. Been over this with full documentation a couple times a year on different forums with some people that don't believe it. You can research it by googling US goverment copyright law and there it is.
What you CAN do, to protect you and the school-come up with a great design for them, mascot, etc.-(if it isn't copyrighted yet) and copyright it with YOUR NAME. Then tell them you own that design but will NOT allow it to be used by anyone without the permission of the school! That way you are 'their guard dog' to prevent bootleg versions...and guaranteeing that any use of that logo has to go through you. It does NOT cost a dime to copyright anything. Just produce the image, with YOUR NAME and current date and the 'copyright' symbol-print up a couple, and mail them to yourself as a registered, return reciept letter and do not open it. Just file it. This puts a government date stamp on a copy to prove you did it first!

[signman]

And a further note...your peewee baseball and football leagues-they can NO LONGER call themselves 'the Red Sox', Indians, etc. and use the mascots of the 'big teams'...the big leagues won a lawsuit involving the kids leagues-soccer, everything-they have to PAY to use ANY registered team name or logo!
And it isn't cheap.
Everything is worth money now...so nothing goes for free.
Always worth putting YOUR name and date on original artwork you create for a client-and if they don't 'buy' that copyright from you-they cannot use it for stationary, ads, vehicle, signs...nothing!

[clint]

Thanks for the replies, they have been very helpful. So if I come up with an original design / mascot and use the city and mascot name, I'll be OK? If its not a copy of someone else's work but has the city and team name, I'm OK? Is there anything that prevents me from using team and city names?

Thanks again

Clint

[Steve]

It takes a little more than some minor modifications to a logo to avoid the copyright laws (and lawsuits.) Here is what happens when you change the colors and name of a University logo. http://deadspin.com/sports/secondhan...age-304778.php

[signman]

If the TEAM NAME is registered, yes, you will be afoul of the laws and it just isn't worth it to go there.
The only way to do it-is DON'T try to market stuff on your own! Deal WITH the groups involved, so that THEY are giving YOU an order to make-whether it is screenprinted or embroidered.
The big difference is 'why' you are making it-as an ORDER directly from 'that group' or if you are making stuff up to sell at flea markets, a kiosk, store-whatever. If YOU don't hold the license or copyright, you just cannot use it. But if you get an ORDER from someone holding the license, then it falls on them.
If a Ford dealer asks you to make 'ford' hats for his crew-that's okay-he's PAID for the rights to use it with his franchise. But if Smilin' Tricky Dicky asks you to make up Ford hats to sell at his summer flea market booth-no, you cannot do it because HE does not hold the license to do it.
Garfield, Calvin and Hobbs, Winny the Poo...nope. None of that stuff. Last year someone was in the chat board here that realized they bought some of the Dakato digitized files and too late, realized it specifies right on the catalog page-NOT TO BE USED FOR SALE. And that MEANS, you can't sell the sweater and throw in that image for free. It means you can't use it period except for your own personal gifts and family.
The Penn state logo-they obviously have THAT LION HEAD registered and copyrighted-and it doesn't matter how much shading or detail is changed or different-that is STILL the same lion head.
Artist in Vermont owns the copyright to any and all artwork containing distinctive black and white cow...and his lawyers WILL go to yardsales and flea markets looking for people making those wood cutouts and painting them the same way.
Remember, if YOU get caught producing copyrighted images, they can SEIZE YOUR SHOP, your inventory, your bank accounts...gone! Until you get through court you've lost it all.
Trust me, I know what can happen...got in the middle of a court case because I made teeshirts for a national distributor that did NOT have the Batman license and said he did!

[Pure Embroidery]

I've heard the legal term "Any Reasonable Likeness" used when it comes to copyrights. The percentage of change rule is a myth for sure.

I make sure I have written permission to use any design that is copyrighted in any way and I NEVER take the client's word for it.

Did some shirts for a Toyota dealership and was working with the "Sales Manager". He actually was a newly hired salesman who used his title liberally. The dealership contacted me and asked why I had made Toyota Uniform shirts for their employee without permission (had the dealership name on the shirts also).

After explaining the situation, I was politely asked not to use the dealership name again, nor the Toyota logo. They did like the embroidery enough to order in the future, but I made damn sure who I was dealing with.

Had a similar issue with Boeing, but went about it the right way and received a letter from their corporate headquarters giving exact permissions and limitations for their logo.

Found out later that I can even use the Boeing font and color without permission. More to it than that, but that's another story.

[clint]

Thanks everyone. I intend to contact the local high schools and teams for permission. How do you know if someone holds a copyright?

[Wishes]

Dear Signman,
I have googled the us gov copyright site and haven't found the ruling about not changing the design at least 10%. Can you offer some direction?
Margaret

[signman]

It doesn't matter how much you change it-period. You cannot use ANY PART of a copyrighted logo irregardless of size, color, repositioning, nothing.
http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html
here is all the basic info about getting or holding a copyright, scroll way down to read the condensed versions and where you find out about registering a copyright and why you do NOT have to register to hold it.
I haven't got a bookmark to find the ruling about 'changes' in existing copyright works but it has been well written about in all my sign magazines.

[Steve]

There was an article in one of the embroidery magazines about embroidering and digitizing copyright/trademark logos a few months ago. Sorry, I can't remember which magazine it was.
It basically said make sure you have permission from the copyright holder (this means if you are doing shirts for a Toyota dealer, make sure you have permission from Toyota and not the dealer. Even if the dealer name is on it because the word TOYOTA is copyrighted too.) The dealer might have permission from Toyota to make stationary and business cards with the Toyota logo that does not mean shirts too. Usually those clauses in franchise contract allow the franchisee to do certain things but the franchisee usually can't do whatever they want to with the logo because they have a store.
The local UPS store that I bring my packages to ship, I tried to sell them shirts but the owner of the store told me they can not buy the shirts from anyone but UPS.

[Wishes]

Impressions May 07 pg. 50 has an article titled Logo Legalities for Local Uses of Nationa Brands and Impressions July 07 pg.12 has another article titled Avoid Trademark Trouble and Copyright Indemnification & Authorization to Use Images Furnished by Buyer. Both have good infomation to show customers.

[signman]

Could you see if that is 'on the web' and post a link for those of us that don't get the trade magazine?
Would be appreciated....
thanks

Roland

[Wishes]

I tried to get the article to show but it did not. Impressions and Stitches are free industry magazines. If you go to their web pages you can sign up for their newsletters and probably the magazine. Do a search for Impressions Magazine and Stitches Magazine
Margaret

[TinaK]

Here are the articles that Wishes mentioned above:

http://www.impressionsmag.com/impres..._id=1003578814

http://www.impressionsmag.com/impres..._id=1003602557